return to running sub 40 10ks

[mark]

After a year break from running and an extended build period, I finally feel like a runner again and want to return to running sub 40 10ks.

I didn’t run the time trial but I have started on the sub 40min programme and just completed the 5x2k, this went better than I was expecting, hence why I started slower than I needed to!

8:15 (hr165) / 8:10 (hr166) / 7:57 (hr170) / 7:53 (hr172) / 7:50 (hr176)

Weather hot (for England)

I have a 10k race on 16th October and I was planning to run 41min, but I now think that I will aim for sub 40min – does that sound sensible?

Regards
Mark

[TheEd]

Hi Mark and welcome to the forums

judging from your 2k session you look to be close to a sub 40 minute 10k

so yes, no harm in aiming for that

just as long as you were taking a 90 second Rest between each 2k?

you welcome to provide feedback and it would be interesting to see how your 6 x 1k session goes

nice going

TheEd

[mark]

Hello TheEd

Thank you for your response, it is very helpful and I appreciate getting some feedback.

I did leave 90s recovery between the 5x2k.

Yesterday I completed the 6x1k with 60s recovery (on an out and back road), I have added the average heart rate for each split to give a fuller picture:

3:36 (hr162) / 3:55 (hr169)
3:39 (hr171) /3:48 (hr168)
3:35 (hr172) /3:49 (hr169)

We are on holiday in rural France, hence the out and back, which was on a slight decline/incline. I am pleased with the splits, I was running hard but not running flat out.

Today I ran the 30 minutes easy and, just like after the 5x2k session, I needed to mix walking and jogging to keep my heart rate down (it was drifting towards 165+ at an easy 11kmph). This is very unusual but as I assume these sessions are meant for recovery so I am not too concerned.

My next quality session is the 5k paced run, as we are traveling back to England on the Sunday, I plan to run this on the Saturday. I plan to run 3min 45sec per kilometer.

Regards and thanks,
Mark

[TheEd]

yes definite recovery needed after quality sessions

the 1k looks decent

as for the 5k paced, you better going off at around 3.55 per k for the first 3k to 4k and then increasing the tempo over the last 1km

there is no need to 'hit' this session as the event that counts is next week

the idea is to go through this at half the pace you hope to race the 10k in next week

enjoy

TheEd
ps.. rather feel good after the paced run than feeling flattened
pps-- enjoy France

[mark]

5k run today, and I followed the advice and paced myself, running the 5k in 19:23. Encouragingly it felt like a pace I could have kept going at for another 5k.

My 1k splits are:
3:55 hr156
3:57 hr165
3:48 hr167
3:52 hr165
3:51 hr164

So now back to England for the final week and the 10k! Thanks TheEd for keeping me on track.

Mark
PS. Enjoying France and feeling good!

[mark]

Wow! These programmes work!

Last weekend I ran my first competitive race for 2 years and beat my 10k personal best running 37:26 on an ‘undulating’ road race, I was absolutely delighted with 1k splits of:

03:53 (hr159)
03:43 (hr167)
03:38 (hr173)
03:40 (hr172)
03:55 (hr169)
03:43 (hr173)
03:43 (hr169)
03:39 (hr172)
03:50 (hr173)
03:42 (hr174)

This programme has really given my running a great focus and boost!

I have another race in three weeks (two weeks now) so I have started on the second loop of the programme and am excited to see how fast I can go.

Yesterday was my 5x2k, I was aiming for ambitious splits of 7:10, but I ended up fading with average splits of 7:20, which I am still happy with:

7:08 (hr168) / 7:15 (hr168) / 7:21 (hr169) / 7:26 (hr168) / 7:30 (hr169)

On this basis I calculate I should be aiming for Sub 37 10k, although I will try and dip under 36 minutes. So I will aim for 3:25 for the 6x1k, 18:30 5k and 80secs for the 10x400m. Hopefully these calculations are logical.

Do you think it is advisable to start adding AM runs? While it might not be necessary for Sub37/36 pace I want to see how quick I can get and figure that starting adding, maybe just one AM run a week now, will mean I can build up slowly. What do you advice?

Still buzzing from running 37:26! Regards
Mark

[TheEd]

congrats Mark .. whereas the programs do work it is certainly the runner who has to do the running

there is no need to up the work rate currently and it would be advisable to not increase the speed for the sessions just yet.

rather consider approaching this cycle more reserved focusing more on the recovery days and then after the next race reconsider the pace according to that result

avoiding injury and problems should be the number one aim

enjoy and congrats again

TheEd

[mark]

Dear TheEd

Thanks for your congratulations and wise words, injury at this point would not be good!

With this in mind I agree not to add any AM runs for the time being.

Can you clarify for me what you mean by focusing more on the recovery days? Do you mean make sure they are not too fast? I currently monitor this with my heart rate monitor, this means they are always at least a minute slower than race pace and sometime slow (even walking).

Also is the pace I suggested too much? I am willing to hold back if it means that I stay away from injury. My logic was having run a 37.26 (and now 3:40 for 5x2k) I could calculate times for a ‘sub 37’ programme (which I calculate as 3:25 for 6x1k, 18:30 for 5k and 80secs for the 10x400m). To clarify are you suggest slightly slower would be better?

FYI - my race plans are this race in two weeks and then another three weeks after that. Then I plan to switch to recovery and build period before completing three more race cycles.

Thanks for your time, I find your feedback really helpful – as I say injury now would not be good.

Mark

[TheEd]

recovery days are the days in-between the quality sessions and if those days are comfortable it determines that the adaptation is moving in the right direction

the major success of the programs is that you learn to train - recover and race

this combines the art and science of training to achieve long-term success

patience plays a major role

hope this helps a little more

TheEd

[mark]

Hi TheEd

My over enthusiastic 5x2k pace has caught up with me.

As you suggested, my pace was too quick and my legs have not recovered properly. My legs have felt heavy for about five days now and I might be bordering on overtraining – clearly an important lesson about patience and small gentle increasing of intensity.

What is the best way to go from here? Obviously rest and recovery is advisable and I am happy to take a cautious approach. My plan is to rest tomorrow (day 9), run a very slow recovery run on Thursday (day 10) and then rest on Friday (day 11).

Then if my legs recovery presumably I can carry on (cautiously) with the programme. If they have not recovered perhaps I should switch to the recovery phase?

(Hopefully I am being overly cautious but still) a valuable lesson that I will hopefully learn!

Mark

P.S. I will try and include a summary of my runs to date below to give you a fuller picture of my training. It is my first race cycle followed by my current race cycle. Hopefully it will appear in a readable format.

Activity Name Pace Avg HR Pace Avg HR

2nd easy 30 recovery 05:23 138
1st easy 30-60 recovery 05:18 140
10K race 03:45 170
rest (day 18) / / / /
easy with 6xPaced (day 17) 05:07 153
easy 40 (day 16) 06:32 151
10x400 (day 15) 03:29 171
easy 30 (day 14) 04:57 145
easy 60 (day 13) missed
5km paced (day 12) 03:53 163
rest (day 11) / / / /
easy 60 (day 10) 05:59 141
easy 30 (day 9) 07:35 140
6 x 1k (day 8) 03:44 168 03:43 167
easy 10k (day 7) 05:31 132 06:33 127
easy 30 (day 6) 07:35 139 06:33 118
Longest run 1:30 (day 5) 05:20 150 05:18 145
rest (day 4) / / / /
5x2k (4.00 /km) (day 3) 04:00 170 03:40 168
easy 30 (day 2) 08:26 137 07:00 110
easy distance 60-70 (day 1) 05:32 145 04:48 147