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+--- Thread: Still aiming for sub 20-min 5k... (/Thread-Still-aiming-for-sub-20-min-5k)
RE: Still aiming for sub 20-min 5k... - GavMoon - 24-10-2024
Ok thanks TheEd, sounds good. November will be all about getting some stability back into the routine. Thanks for the pace tips too!
RE: Still aiming for sub 20-min 5k... - TheEd - 20-11-2024
Hi GM .. how are things progressing?
TheEd
RE: Still aiming for sub 20-min 5k... - GavMoon - 21-11-2024
Hi TheEd - thanks for checking in. I've been getting some more consistency this month and things are getting back to normal as you expected.
Long runs around 13/14k on Sundays. The weekly total is around 35k. The structure has had to move a bit as I'm doing an open water swim once a week and that will become an evening group activity from next month, so things are shuffling around a bit, but it's all good fun.
The runs are currently something like:
- Long run Sunday
- 4-5k tempo Monday or Weds (either just after the OW swim or earlier in the day)
- Easy 8k somewhere
- Intervals session somewhere
- The odd ROTB if I can fit one in
The challenge is that two rides a week are really quite intense. One is threshold and one is VO2. These are hard - e.g. Tuesday's ride was 8x3 mins VO2 where each interval had the HR up in the 160s or nudging 170. But the body seems to be absorbing it so I hope it is making me fitter.
Garmin's 5k prediction has come back down from 21 mins to 20:18 as of this morning.
I've been doing 1/2/3k intervals at something like 4:20/4:25 pace which I think is around my threshold. Then if I do a 400s session they are faster like 3:50.
I did 7x1k this morning with 1 min easy between the intervals. They were all around 4:20 pace (1st one 4:26, last one 4:14) and the max HR on the last one was 168 (lower 160s for the others) and the average HR was 150s). It was a solid session but felt pretty good.
So I think I'm doing ok training, and Garmin's prediction is moving in the right direction, but I *feel* I am some way from holding 4:04 pace for 4k which was what I did in the 4k test about 6 months ago.
Cheers, GM
RE: Still aiming for sub 20-min 5k... - TheEd - 24-11-2024
nice GM .. keep up the good work and try not to bang it too much once you start feeling stronger
please keep me updated as you go forward
TheEd
RE: Still aiming for sub 20-min 5k... - GavMoon - 13-12-2024
Hi TheEd, ok so the tri on Sunday went fairly well. I came in 8th out of 56 in my age cat, which was definitely better than expected.
- The swim was choppy and tough - 7/56
- The bike felt good - 16/56 (I might get a TT bike soon which will change things...)
- The run was hard but I felt I paced it ok and didn't have much left by the end - 7/56.
The run time was 21m51s so about 4:22/km pace.
This was made harder (slower) because of:
1. I stopped to sort out my shoe (tongue was twisted). Probably didn't cost much time but felt like an eternity!
2. The way out was along a beach path and the way back was along a road which was quite a bit higher up, so there were some steps / steep hill to get up to the road.
My current target is to be able to run a sub 21 minute 5k in a tri.
Based on recent training that pace seems about right though. I feel a 5k in a tri is about a minute slower than a standalone 5k and as mentioned before, I don't feel my form has been that amazing.
Garmin says my threshold pace is 4:19 at the moment and I also feel like that's the sort of pace I end up being able to hold in a 5k in a tri.
So that's how the race went.
RE: Still aiming for sub 20-min 5k... - TheEd - 13-12-2024
Hi GM .. congrats .. treat it as a success in getting to and participating in the event
now to recover for at least 3 days and then to move forward slowly achieving consistent training
have you any short-term and long-term goals as such?
TheEd
RE: Still aiming for sub 20-min 5k... - GavMoon - 13-12-2024
Now for the training. I've been having a recovery week this week and then I have 8 weeks until the next one so quite a good chunk of time. The weekly load will be:
- 1 swim
- 1 strength session
- 3 rides (1 VO2 intervals, 1 threshold intervals, 1 easy)
- 4 runs
I'm planning to try to get more rest / sleep as well as I wonder if that has been holding me back a bit.
In terms of the running, what I had in mind for the 4 sessions was:
- 1 easy long (13-15k)
- 1 intervals 400s, 1k, 2k, 3k intervals etc (7-10k)
- 1 easy (8k)
- 1 easy or maybe slightly faster like "steady" or tempo or threshold (7-10k)
So 35-40k a week.
That's what I was thinking, but I would love some guidance please. Any suggestions on the overall structure or some individual sessions you'd recommend? Would you like me to do another 4k?
RE: Still aiming for sub 20-min 5k... - GavMoon - 08-01-2025
Hi TheEd, two updates from my side.
First, the current training approach. I've been trying a few new angles:
1. Consistently close to 40k per week with every 4th week easier/less. (If I'm honest with myself I was up and down a bit week to week.)
2. Longer intervals sessions (not faster though). I've been doing more stuff like 2 mile and 1 mile reps (around 4:15 pace), for a total of around 8k of intervals. So these runs are 10-12k now.
3. Strength work after 3 of the runs - just some calf raises, lunges and hamstring work for a few mins.
4. Trying to rest and recover more - food, sleep, foam rolling, stretching. This is a challenge with work and kids but let's see.
So the typical week is now something like:
- Sunday - Easy long 14-15k
- Tuesday - Intervals as described above. Might be 400s or 1k intervals sometimes too.
- Wednesday - easy 8k
- Friday - easy with some "steady" which might be 2x10 mins or 4k steady, around 4:40 pace.
The second update is that I did a 4k test this morning and it came in at 15:52. I was happy and surprised with this. Looks like we're in business!
A quick run down of how it went:
- This was a full effort - mentally I had all the nerves and anticipation of a race.
- Didn't think I could beat the 16:16 from last time (was it May?)
- First 500m were close to 4:00 pace and I didn't feel too bad and suddenly thought it might be possible - maybe a 4:02 overall.
- 1st km was about 4:03
- 2nd km I concentrated on running efficiently and pushing on. Brought the average down to about 4:00
- 3rd km I didn't want to fade, so pushed harder. Average came down to 3:59. It was starting to get really hard now, but seeing I might break 16 mins was a big motivator.
- 4th km was super hard. I wanted to stop, I wanted to cry. I felt I wasn't getting enough air in my lungs. Brought the average down to 3:58.
I was surprised because it seems that despite mostly training at 4:15 pace, I've become better at running 4:00 pace.
It was also important for me mentally to see that 4:00 is not a ceiling. I've been aiming for a 20-min 5k for so long now I almost started to believe I'd never go under 4:00 pace.
Any comments or advice welcome!
ETA: HR was above 180 for a good chunk of the 4k. Peaked at 185. This is a new max. Garmin's auto detection had put my max HR in the mid-170s over the last month or so.
RE: Still aiming for sub 20-min 5k... - TheEd - 08-01-2025
this is nice to read GM .. you have well and truly got the interval distance up, if going onto the 5 x 2k try to organise someone who can at least run 3 of the 2000's with you
nice to be in sub 16 shape for 4km .. quite well paced
try to set-up a 2 week schedule so you don't push hard each week
over to you and all the best for 2025
TheED
RE: Still aiming for sub 20-min 5k... - GavMoon - 18-03-2025
Hi TheEd, I'm nearing the end of the season now. Last race is on Sunday.
I'm wondering what I should do differently over winter for my running. Do athletes tend to focus on easy distance (= 'aerobic base'?) with less of the intervals / tempo sessions or do they continue as they were?
Cheers!